TRANSCRIPT
Of
SENATOR MITCH FIFIELD
Sky News AM Agenda
Ashleigh Gillon & Senator Mark Arbib
4 August 2008
8:30am
E & OE
SUBJECTS: Peter Costello, economy, inflation, grocery price review, Indigenous jobs plan
ASHLEIGH GILLON:
Well let’s get straight to our panel in Sydney we’re joined by Labor Senator Mark Arbib and in Melbourne we’re joined by Liberal Senator Mitch Fifield. Mark Arbib firstly to you The Australian’s Dennis Shanahan says today the Rudd Government is anxious and perhaps even frightened of Peter Costello taking over from Brendan Nelson, is he right?
SENATOR MARK ARBIB:
Not at all. We respect any leader on the other side, we respect Brendan Nelson, if it’s Peter Costello we’ll show him the same respect, if it’s Malcolm Turnbull we’ll show him the same respect. We’re doing our job which is putting out a positive vision for the country, you know, we’re putting out a vision on education, on skills, on climate change and ETS. So we’re doing the job at the moment for the country. On the other side the Coalition is caught up in a guessing game. Will he or won’t he? And the way they’ve treated their leader this week, I mean he was just humiliated on the emissions trading scheme, Brendan Nelson, and really they should be talking about the big ideas, but they’re having a guessing game about who’s going to be the leader, and on that, really, is Peter Costello serious? Is he going to take the leadership? Or is this a marketing campaign for his book? I think Australians deserve better than what they’re seeing from the Coalition at the moment.
GILLON:
Well Senator yesterday your colleagues were certainly out in attack mode against Peter Costello. Let’s take a look at some of that.
KEVIN RUDD:
…his being part and parcel of a Government which was engaged in climate change denial and WorkChoices, and Mr Costello among the others, wanting to take WorkChoices even further.
LINDSAY TANNER:
Peter Costello is an on the record industrial relations extremist. He thought that WorkChoices didn’t go far enough. He wanted to get rid of unfair dismissal laws altogether.
SIMON CREAN:
He’s also the Treasurer that has had a manic obsession in terms of pursuing an agenda that really cost the previous government a lot in the last election, WorkChoices.
GILLON:
Mark Arbib aren’t these attacks a little bit premature? Doesn’t it show that the [Labor] Party is worried?
ARBIB:
Not at all. I mean these are things we’ve been saying for months and months. And there’s no doubt about it, Peter Costello’s record, his legacy, is there for everyone to see. I mean, inflation when he left, 16 year high, 10 straight interest rate rises, the highest interest rates in the OECD. It’s clear, in terms of WorkChoices, we all know he would’ve gone further on WorkChoices. So I mean they’re just making the point, that’s his legacy, that’s his record. I mean his own party want him to make a decision now. I mean this has now cut across to his own MPs who are saying ‘just tell us what you want to do ‘cos we want to get on with it.’ We’re in the same position. We’re debating ideas. We’re out there putting a position vision for the company. Coalition, it’s a guessing game. Is it a marketing campaign or is it a leadership campaign? Maybe Mitch will know, he’s a good friend of Peter’s.
GILLON:
Well Mitch Fifield I was going to ask you, does Mark Arbib have a point? If Peter Costello does come back will the Coalition be opening itself up to renewed attacks on things like WorkChoices which obviously the Australian people have made their views very clear on at the last election.
SENATOR MITCH FIFIELD:
Well Peter Costello has made his position clear. The day after the election, Peter declared that he wasn’t available for the leadership of the Party. That remains the case. But I’ve got to say it was extraordinary to look at half of the Labor Government over the weekend coming out attacking a Liberal backbencher, attacking someone who wasn’t in the country. It was a combination of hysteria and fear on the part of Labor. We’re very proud of what Peter achieved as Treasurer of Australia. We’re very proud of the achievements of the former government and we’re certainly going to embrace those.
GILLON:
Well Senator we know you’re a big fan of Peter Costello, but so too is Tony Abbott it seems. Let’s have a look at him on Sky yesterday.
TONY ABBOTT:
I’d love to see Peter stay in the parliament and I would be rolling out the red carpet for him tomorrow if he wanted to stay in the Parliament. I’m confident that within 30 seconds of him making himself available he’d be back on the front bench…
…We are all publicly saying what a terrific bloke he is, what a fantastic political talent he is, how much we miss him. We love him, we want him…
GILLON:
Well Mitch Fifield, you love him, you want him, but does Costello love you back? Are you getting any hints on this? You’re close to him.
FIFIELD:
Of course we love Peter. But as I say, Peter was very up front the day after the election. He did the right thing by the Party. He made his intentions clear and that was that he wasn’t available for the leadership of the Party. That remains the case today. Nothing has changed. Labor are working themselves up into an incredible lather. They’re so easily spooked. The Labor Government have such a lack of confidence in themselves that it’s quite bizarre that they’re reacting in this way. That they’re getting so excited and so hysterical.
ARBIB:
Oh come off it Mitch, it was Tony Abbott getting himself lathered up yesterday.
FIFIELD:
Tony was saying that he thinks Peter is a great guy and has made a terrific contribution to Australia, which is the case.
ARBIB:
It was sickening! Come on!
FIFIELD:
What Labor realise is that Peter, when his name is mentioned, people think of the strong economy during our time in office. People think of unemployment coming down. People think of Labor debt being paid down. That’s why Labor are spooked…
ARBIB:
What about WorkChoices?
FIFIELD:
…by the mention of Peter Costello’s name because when you mention Peter Costello people think of our record in government and they look back pretty fondly on it.
GILLON:
So Mitch Fifield are you saying that the leadership is Peter Costello’s for the taking if he wants it?
FIFIELD:
What I’m saying is that Peter Costello made clear that he’s not available for the leadership and that remains the case. He flagged that he was thinking about the next phase of his professional life. He said that he would do that with his family and I’m sure that’s what he’s doing.
ARBIB:
But Ashleigh can I just say that the problem in the end for the Coalition is not the people, I mean, it’s really about their policies and their ideals. Where they stand on the big issues. Again, on climate change, there are so many sceptics in that caucus. I mean no wonder Brendan Nelson was trying to move to a more conservative position because half his actual caucus are sceptical that climate change actually exists. On WorkChoices, they long for the past, most of his MPs would love to go back to WorkChoices and take it even further because that’s what they actually believe in. They’re completely out of touch with the Australian population. So in the end it doesn’t matter whether it’s Peter Costello, Brendan Nelson or Malcolm Turnbull or even Tony Abbott. It’s their ideas that are the problem. They are in the past.
GILLON:
Well Mark Arbib yesterday your colleague and the former opposition leader Simon Crean was keen to give out some free advice. Here’s him on Meet The Press yesterday.
CREAN:
…you’ve got to have policy consistency. The second is the party does not reward the destabilisers. Now this is sound advice offered in good faith to the Liberal Party. Let them sort it out from there. I’ve not opened up a consultancy in leadership issues for them, but there were some fundamentals that I think straddle both sides of the fence.
GILLON:
Mitch Fifield you must agree that the current mood of uncertainty and disarray is damaging the party?
FIFIELD:
Well there isn’t uncertainty. I see media commentators…
GILLON:
Come on Mitch.
FIFIELD:
…calling for Peter Costello to declare his position and Mark Arbib is calling for him to state what he’s going to do but the simple fact is, Peter’s already done that. He did it the day after the election. He declared that he wasn’t available for the leadership and that remains the case. But I must say to Mark Arbib, saying that Peter should make his intentions clear. Mark, at least set foot on the floor of the Parliament before you start giving advice to, putting partisanship aside, one of the greats of Australian politics.
ARBIB:
We all just want to know what he wants to do, but it’s your own side Mitch that’s out there saying it so maybe you should give the advice to Tony Abbott, ‘cos he wants to know what he wants to do too.
FIFIELD:
Well it’s very clear to all of us what Peter’s position is.
GILLON:
Well Brendan Nelson is heading overseas this week. Mitch Fifield, is he dodging the heat?
FIFIELD:
Not at all, not at all. It’s an important part of an opposition leader’s role as the alternative prime minister to be in touch with global economic events, to make contacts with opinion leaders and political leaders overseas and that’s what Brendan is doing.
GILLON:
Alright well we need to go to a quick break but coming up we’ll be taking a look at whether or not Australia is heading for a recession. That’s next on Agenda.
Break
Welcome back to AM Agenda. We’re chatting with the Labor Senator Mark Arbib and the Liberal Senator Mitch Fifield. Well all of this speculation about Peter Costello’s future comes as a renewed spotlight on the economy and the Rudd Government’s ability to handle it. Yesterday the Finance Minister Lindsay Tanner was keen to play down talk of a recession telling everyone to take a deep breath and calm down. Let’s have a look.
TANNER:
It’s important that we understand here that we are not having a sudden slow down. Yes the economy is slowing. Yes we need to take the steam out of inflation. But people talking recession I think are getting way ahead of the facts.
GILLON:
Mark Arbib it would be political suicide wouldn’t it to guarantee that there won’t be a recession?
ARBIB:
Well, I mean look, what we’re talking about and what Lindsay said yesterday was that the economy is robust. There’s no doubt about it. Our growth rates are still good. Our unemployment figures are still low. We’ve got a $22b surplus. So the government has done its job. The budget is in the black. The economy is in the black. At the same time as that we’re benefiting from record high commodity prices. So a recession is two quarters of negative growth so, I mean I don’t think we’re heading towards that. The country is still in a strong position and our job is to get through, guide the economy and strengthen it through these tough global times. It’s pretty easy to forget but, at the moment, the Australian economy is being buffeted by three global crises. You’ve got a global oil crisis, you’ve got a global agricultural crisis and you’ve got a global banking crisis. And this is affecting economies throughout the world. The United States is teetering on recession. You’ve seen a big slowdown throughout Europe, throughout Asia, and at the same time now Australia is facing an inflation legacy left by the previous government. As I said earlier, when Peter Costello and John Howard lost the government well we had a 16 year high inflation figure. So these are tough challenges but the economy is doing well. So ah, no, I think we’re going OK.
GILLON:
So we’re not heading towards a recession in your point of view?
ARBIB:
The economy is still robust, and you’re still seeing low unemployment figures, you’re still seeing growth, and ah, no.
GILLON:
Well Senator Fifield do you think the economy will just keep ticking along as Lindsay Tanner says?
FIFIELD:
Well I’ve got to tell you, Wayne Swan has been doing his level best to kill the Australian economy with his talk of inflation genies coming out of bottles. He’s been incredibly irresponsible. He’s really talked down the economy. Consumer confidence has taken a huge hit. When you’re Treasurer, part of your job is to talk up the strengths of your economy. Wayne Swan certainly hasn’t done that and I think the Labor Government is now finding out just how hard it is to actually run an economy. Mark referred to the global uncertainty and how that could be seeing the edge taken off growth. I think it’s worth remembering that during the Asian economic crisis we managed to ensure that Australia was still growing strongly. Just because there’s global uncertainty, just because there are problems beyond our shoes, that doesn’t automatically mean that the Australian domestic economy has to take a hit. We’ll wait and see…
ARBIB:
But you ignored inflation Mitch, your government ignored inflation. 20 Reserve Bank warnings and you didn’t respond.
FIFIELD:
Well actually I’m surprised you raise those supposed 20 Reserve Bank warnings Mark because, Ashleigh, Mark took a bit of a hit on the editorial pages of The Australian today. The Australian editorial made the point that it’s actually not true that there were 20 Reserve Bank warnings…
ARBIB:
That was Malcolm Turnbull making the point…
FIFIELD:
…that’s a bit of…
ARBIB:
…That was Malcolm Turnbull making the point, Mitch, come on, there was 20 Reserve Bank warnings…
FIFIELD:
And the Australian editorial agreed with that point. Because the fact is that Labor weren’t talking about an inflation crisis before the election. Treasury’s own estimates in our last budget, their own forecasts of inflation showed that there was a benign outlook for inflation. So just because Wayne Swan says that there were 20 Reserve Bank warnings doesn’t make it so. And Mark, just a warning for you, you can’t rely on what Wayne Swan says for your lines, he’s not a reliable source, you need to come up with your own material.
ARBIB:
So Mitch why did interest rates go up 10 times under the previous government? I mean if inflation wasn’t an issue what was going on?
FIFIELD:
Well inflation is a challenge that we face but Wayne Swan has been incredibly irresponsible in calling it a crisis. The Reserve Bank Governor himself has said that there is no inflation crisis. It’s a problem. It’s a problem that can be dealt with.
GILLON:
Well the Reserve Bank is meeting tomorrow. It’s expected they will decide to keep rates on hold. But Mark Arbib, if rates don’t go down before Christmas it’s not good news for the government is it?
ARBIB:
Well look, Reserve Bank rates, I mean that’s set by the Reserve Bank. They’re independent. They’ve got to make their own decision. It’s important that politicians aren’t getting in the way of them or putting political pressure on the Reserve Bank. I would hope at some stage there would be a turn in terms of rates but, that may be way out, who knows? They’ve got to make that call themselves. But certainly the Government is doing everything it can to help working families. Go to the last budget and what, in terms of the tax cuts which came effect on July 1, it’s $45b worth of tax cuts, especially to middle income and lower income families. On top of that, childcare rebate, we increased the rebate from 30% to 50%, another good thing, and the education tax refund. So the Reserve Bank are doing their thing but at the same time we’re ensuring working families have the support they need through the tax and welfare system.
GILLON:
Well talking about working families and cost of living pressures, this week we’re expecting to see the findings of the government’s grocery review to be made public. Here’s Lindsay Tanner playing down expectations that this is going to result in any major reduction in the price of food. Let’s have a look.
TANNER:
Obviously they’re not going to turn a kilo of coffee from $25 down to $15 or they’re not going to change the price of a thing of nappies from $15 to $10. But every little bit counts. There’s a lot of people out there who have very tight family budgets and so any reduction we can manage through greater competition in supermarkets, greater competition in grocery prices generally, will benefit ordinary working families in this country.
GILLON:
Mark Arbib what can the Government really do to bring down grocery prices? Does this report and review risk becoming another FuelWatch debacle?
ARBIB:
I would totally disagree. I think FuelWatch is something that will work once it’s put in place. So I mean it has got to get through the Senate and obviously the Coalition is saying they’ll oppose it. But any device that provides more openness and transparency to consumers has got to be a good thing. And really, they need to know what the prices are across their city, across their suburb, and that will help them. In terms of the grocery price review, well this has been a long term project now since the beginning of the year. There’s been something like 200 submissions to the ACCC, and we’ll see their response today and also some preliminary recommendations from the Government. What we’re about obviously, as Lindsay Tanner said, there’s no silver bullet to these sort of, to prices. But hopefully through greater competition and greater transparency we can put downward pressure on prices. There’s already been some changes in terms of the foreign investment rules, allowing foreign companies to come in and start competing on a fairer ground. You’ve already seen a company, ‘Cosco,’ an international supermarket chain who are going to come in to Melbourne and I think reforms like that will help put downward pressure on prices.
GILLON:
Mitch Fifield your response?
FIFIELD:
Yeah Ashleigh the simple truth is that Labor fibbed to the Australian people before the election that they could do something about grocery prices. They can’t.
ARBIB:
That is not true.
FIFIELD:
Grocery prices are going up because of the drought. They’re going up because of a huge surge in global demand. They’re going up because of arable land which is being used to produce things like ethanol. This will just be another scheme, like FuelWatch. And I don’t know what planet, what world people like Lindsay Tanner and Mark Arbib live in. Just think, supermarkets have literally thousands of items on their shelves. How could a website possibly have thousands of items at multiple supermarkets, the prices of which change day by day? So when a consumer goes to the supermarket if they manage to find a particular product at a particular supermarket, the price has probably changed anyway. That’s not real world. That’s not the way people shop. They’re not going to sit on the internet going through thousands of product items. It’s just a cover for the fact that Labor can’t do anything about grocery prices and they shouldn’t have told the Australian people that they could.
GILLON:
Mark Arbib do you acknowledge that voters may have got the impression from Kevin Rudd that he will bring down grocery prices and petrol prices during the election campaign?
ARBIB:
I don’t think so. We were very clear in terms of what we said we could do and what we said we couldn’t do before the election. But we are doing our best to try and take the pressures off working families, there’s no doubt about it. This inquiry hopefully will bring down some recommendations that will increase competition and increase transparency in that industry. And I mean, again, I think FuelWatch and any device where consumers can get the prices online has got to be a good thing. Really, the more information consumers have, it’s fantastic. And you talk to the NRMA about FuelWatch and they’re effusive, they love it, they think its fantastic and its something that, you know even if it reduces prices by a couple of cents, well that will go a long way to help working families. But Mitch was right, the one thing I will agree with Mitch on food prices, there is a global crisis in terms of food prices where food prices are going through the roof because of demand out of India, demand out of China and also climatic conditions like the drought in this country so there are things that are out of our control.
GILLON:
Mitch Fifield we are running out of time I just quickly want to cover off another issue. We’ve learnt that Tony Abbott is heading off to teach Indigenous kids remedial English. Kevin Rudd announced yesterday a new partnership with corporates to provide jobs to Indigenous Australians. Is that the sort of program that has bi-partisan support Senator Fifield?
FIFIELD:
Look we want to look at and support anything that can help Indigenous Australians get a job, to help them close the gap in life expectancy and health. I pay full credit to Twiggy Forrest and to Noel Pearson for this concept. And also congratulations to the CIS Consilium because I read in the paper that Twiggy and Noel actually got together at the Consilium, kicking around some ideas, and that they agreed that this would be a terrific thing to pursue. So full marks to them for putting this forward. We hope it works. Anything we can do to help Indigenous Australians we should.
GILLON:
Well Mark Arbib it sounds like a good idea on the front but we seem to have few details about how it will actually work. Yesterday the Prime Minister couldn’t say how much it will cost. Is this just another grand plan without many details being thought through?
ARBIB:
This plan is being put forward by Andrew Forrest and Fortescue and he is working in with companies throughout the country and I think what’s important here is, in really big issues like this, people just rely on government and think government can solve all their problems. But what we need is a partnership. A partnership with the private sector and a partnership with the community. And to try and reduce the gap on Indigenous standards of living, well I think this is a great proposal being put forward by Andrew Forrest and the private sector and hopefully it will have an effect. 50,000 jobs in two years, if they can get half way to that, even a third to that, well I think they’re doing amazing, amazing work.
GILLON:
Well we have run out of time for today’s show. Mitch Fifield and Mark Arbib thank you for joining us on AM Agenda today. Don’t forget to join Kieran Gilbert this afternoon at 4:15 eastern for PM Agenda. For now I’m Ashleigh Gillon, thanks for your company.
ENDS