TRANSCRIPT
Of
SENATOR MITCH FIFIELD
Sky News AM Agenda
Kieran Gilbert & Senator Mark Arbib
22 September 2008
8:30am
E & OE
SUBJECTS: Opinion polls, Malcolm Turnbull, shadow front bench, PM’s overseas trip
KIERAN GILBERT:
Good morning to our panel now. Liberal Senator Mitch Fifield and Labor Senator Mark Arbib. Gentleman thanks for your time.
SENATOR MITCH FIFIELD:
Goo morning.
SENATOR MARK ARBIB:
Thank you.
GILBERT:
Mitch first of all I’ve gotta ask you, you look at these polls, did you get it wrong in backing Brendan Nelson?
FIFIELD:
Well obviously we all like to see the polls go up rather than down. I don’t think any of us are going to get too carried away at this stage. It’s a long time between now and the next election. But full credit to (the Leader) for his poll debut. But I think what the polls are showing is that nine months of the Rudd Government, nine months of the Opposition making the case that the Government has totally ignored the plight of Australians and cost of living issues. We’ve been making that point over and over again that the Government promised to do something about cost of living pressures. They haven’t. We’ve suggested they have a 5c a litre cut on fuel excise. We’ve suggested and we’ll be introducing legislation to introduce an increase to the single pension. I think that these polls are reflecting that we’ve been making our case and it’s starting to be heard.
GILBERT:
Mark, Malcolm Turnbull is seen as strong and decisive, as good an economic manager as Kevin Rudd. This is within a week. That’s a pretty good start for the Liberal Leader isn’t it?
ARBIB:
He’s also seen as pretty arrogant and out of touch. Those are two big things that are playing out in the electorate. But overall polls will go up, polls will go down. We always knew the Liberal Party would get a bounce out of their first poll. We’ve got to remember that Brendan Nelson was off such a low base that there had to be some sort of lift. So we’ve seen a lift. There’s two individual polls out with differing stories. Let’s sort of say it’s a mid-point is where the truth is. They’ve got a bounce. We expected it. And I think over the next couple of months you’re going to see more volatility. Voters now know that they can send a message through polls. So I think over the next six to eight months you’re gonna see polls shifting up all over the place.
GILBERT:
But Malcolm Turnbull having that, I suppose, bringing with him that innate credibility on economic management. People think he’s a good economic manager straight off the bat. That’s a pretty decisive issue isn’t it? And it will be over the next few years as well.
ARBIB:
Well they haven’t really heard his policies yet. When they start hearing that he’s blocking the budget surplus, or the budget revenue and threatening the budget surplus, that will probably change. In the end, you know really, the personalities have changed but the policies haven’t changed. This is an Opposition that is still committed to WorkChoices, they’re still committed to individual contracts…
FIFIELD:
I think Julia’s committed to WorkChoices these days.
ARBIB:
…they’re still committed to opposing unfair dismissal laws, they’re still climate change deniers and remember on Malcolm Turnbull, and one of the reasons people think he’s out of touch, after the seventh straight interest rate rise, Malcolm Turnbull said the effect had been over-dramatised. So I think the Australian people know that Malcolm Turnbull is out of touch and arrogant.
GILBERT:
Okay Mitch how important is it that Malcolm Turnbull and his team address that issue? That they are aware that he is perceived as, you know, as out of touch and arrogant. How important is it that they combat that?
FIFIELD:
I think Malcolm is perceived as strong and today’s polls show that he is seen very much as a decisive individual. I think that decisiveness is also reflected in the poll figures on who is best placed to deal with the economy. Malcolm is a decisive individual. He’s got a strong economic track record. He’s got a great understanding of business and I think that’s what we’re seeing reflected in the polls.
GILBERT:
He was asked about a similar poll result yesterday on the Nine Network. Let’s recap a bit of what Mr Turnbull had to say in regards to that arrogant perception.
MALCOLM TURNBULL:
Well, look, I listen to all of that. It’s very important to hear all those messages and it’s also very important for me to engage with the Australian people, make sure that people get to know me well or better than they do now. And as Leader of the Opposition obviously I’m in a very good position to do that.
GILBERT:
That was Malcolm Turnbull on the Nine Network yesterday. Senator Fifield how important is it for Malcolm Turnbull though in terms of shaping his image to be creating a perception of himself rather than let the Labor Party do it.
FIFIELD:
It’s very important that we define ourselves rather than have the Opposition define us. But the great thing about Malcolm is there’s no mucking around with Malcolm. You know exactly where he stands. And the contrast with Kevin Rudd could not be clearer. Kevin Rudd is a do nothing Prime Minister. He talks a good game but he never follows through on anything. We’ve got 161 reviews that this Government have announced. Nothing ever quite seems to get done. And we’ve heard it over and over again that this Government is like The Hollowmen and the really sad thing is that The Hollowmen is no longer considered political satire. It’s embraced as a documentary.
GILBERT:
Senator Arbib, the new Liberal Leader brings, obviously he’s a former merchant banker. It’s a time of global economic uncertainty. But he’s also well across the carbon emissions trading issues, a former environment minister when the Shergold Report was handed down. Is he the right man for the times? Are you worried that that’s the case that he will prove to be a thorn in your side on those two crucial issues?
ARBIB:
Well on climate change and water his record is clear. He sat in the cabinet, a cabinet that did not sign off on ratifying the Kyoto Protocol.
GILBERT:
He argued for it though and on water he oversaw a $10 billion water plan.
ARBIB:
Well he says he argued for it, but did he really? And in the end he wasn’t strong enough to carry across his cabinet. And on water, I mean he was the minister who added not one gigalitre to the Murray Darling. In fact, not a gigalitre, he added not one drop to the Murray Darling River. Despite the problems, despite the need for more water. Not one. So I mean his record on water and his record on the environment are questionable. But in terms of being a merchant banker, okay, I mean does that really give him the experience he needs on the economy? It’s the merchant bankers over in the United States that have caused all the trouble we’re in at the moment. So let’s be a bit sort of circumspect about the strength of him being a merchant banker.
GILBERT:
The preferred Prime Minister ratings, Turnbull has already halved the gap between Rudd and Nelson. He’s halved it in one week. Does it show to you, are you worried that the support for Kevin Rudd is soft up against a viable alternative?
ARBIB:
First off, I said this at the start, Nelson was off such a low base. There was always gonna be a lift. If there was no lift, then really, what was the use of changing? Mitch may have been right. But there had to be a lift, there’s been a lift, we’re going to have to see over the next couple of months. But again, the thing that’s important for me is, really, the personalities have changed but the policies haven’t. They’re still the same on WorkChoices. They’re still the same denying climate change. And on interest rates, as Malcolm Turnbull said, seven rises and he said it was over-dramatised. The effects on families, over-dramatised.
GILBERT:
Okay Mitch Fifield, in terms of Malcolm Turnbull and what he brings to this role. You were one of the two Liberals that spoke out in support of Brendan nelson. Do you expect that there will be any retribution or do you expect that you might be stymied in your own prospects for the front bench?
FIFIELD:
Malcolm is going to present a front bench of all the talents. He’s going to present a front bench which is based on merit. It will have a lot of our wise heads who have been ministers before. People like Eric Abetz and Nick Minchin and Julie Bishop. And I hope that there’ll be some of our really bright talent, people like Marise Payne and Sophie Mirabella. So I think all those people will be there. Malcolm wants to do the best he can. He wants to make sure that we’re in a winning position to beat Labor…
GILBERT:
Do you regret speaking out?
FIFIELD:
…and Malcolm will not do anything that gets in the way of us defeating the Labor Party at the next election.
GILBERT:
Do you regret speaking out in support of the guy that lost?
FIFIELD:
No. I’ve got no regrets. In this business you’ve got to call it as you see it. The party room has made a decision. We’re all totally behind (the Leader). I supported the last leader and I support this leader.
GILBERT:
So in terms of this polling though, is this going to help unify and bring people like yourself who backed Nelson, to bring you and your fellow MPs and Senators behind Mr Turnbull?
FIFIELD:
Well Malcolm has my 100% support. I want to see Malcolm as the next Prime Minister of Australia. Every single member of our party room wants to see Malcolm as the next Prime Minister of Australia because Malcolm is a person who actually has ideas. Malcolm is a person with a plan. Malcolm wants to hold this Government to account, beat them at the next election, and start introducing policies which can make sure that Australian living standards remain high…
GILBERT:
And this polling gives it a bit of a kick along too you would’ve thought.
FIFIELD:
Well we all like numbers to go up rather than down. It’s early days. We’ve got a bit over two years before the next election. But it’s a good start.
ARBIB:
You’ve come a long way in a week Mitch. You’ve come a long way in a week.
FIFIELD:
Mark, I’ve always…
ARBIB:
You weren’t saying that when you were on Sky News out there, taking up the running for Brendan Nelson.
FIFIELD:
Mark I’ve always been a fan of both Brendan and Malcolm…
ARBIB:
Okay.
FIFIELD:
…and it’s great that we’ve got Malcolm in that position. He’s hit the ground running. He’s not going to pussy foot around with Kevin. Kevin is going to know that he’s got someone on his tail 24 hours a day, seven days a week so…
ARBIB:
Wasn’t Brendan Nelson doing that?
FIFIELD:
He was.
ARBIB:
Oh okay.
FIFIELD:
But he’s got someone else on his tail now. I think Kevin is going to know he’s alive. That’s for sure.
ARBIB:
Well, we’ll enjoy the challenge.
FIFIELD:
Yes.
GILBERT:
Alright gentleman we’ll be back with you very shortly.
Interview with Martin O’Shannessy from Newspoll
Break
Welcome back to AM Agenda and our panel Senator Mitch Fifield and Senator Mark Arbib. Mitch the Shadow Cabinet to be announced at 10 o’clock this morning eastern time we’re told. Julie Bishop is going to get Treasury as we understand it, Christopher Pyne – Education, Peter Dutton Health. What do you make of those appointments if they do eventuate as we anticipate?
FIFIELD:
Like you I’ll have to wait until 10 o’clock for the announcement but if that is the line up, that’s terrific. Julie has a real capacity to cut through. She’s a terrific presence on the floor of the Parliament. Chris Pyne is one of the Party’s truly great talents. He’s ceaseless, his opponents know he’s there, he never gets off their scent, but he’s also a great policy guy. He’s got terrific ideas. So if he is in education then he’ll really help frame the debate there and show the philosophical differentiation between our two parties’ approaches on education. And Peter Dutton, he’s really proved himself as Shadow Finance Minister. He’s the sort of person who can turn his hand to any portfolio and its particularly important to have some high profile Queenslanders in the line-up because we do need to win seats back in Queensland at the next election. So if that’s the line-up in those portfolios then I think that’s a very strong team.
GILBERT:
Mark how does the appointment of Julie Bishop change the dynamic and how do you see that playing out up against Wayne Swan?
ARBIB:
Well I don’t know how much it changes the dynamic. Again, the personalities are changing but the policies aren’t. If she walks into that Parliament and she again tries to block our revenue measures we’re talking about a massive whole in our budget surplus. We’re talking about $6 billion sort of out the window. So really, in the end, she’s got to decide whether she’s going to be responsible or irresponsible. Malcolm Turnbull’s already gone in one direction, let’s see what Julie Bishop says. WorkChoices, she was the one pushing the AWA to sole contracts. Let’s see if she changes her mind on that. So I think while there’s been a change in the sort of characters, you’re not seeing a change in sort of core Liberal DNA. The policies are the same.
GILBERT:
And Pyne to education, Dutton to health, they’re two fairly forceful characters on to the front line areas of education and health.
ARBIB:
Well really, it’s amazing they’re gonna give some, you know they’re actually gonna start, you know, looking at these areas. Because in the past you’ve seen on education, when the Coalition were last in office, education spending went down. We ranked 2nd last in the OECD tables on education spending. So if they’re gonna start actually looking at it well that’s probably a positive step for them. On health, same thing again. Last time they were in government health spending dropped by 5%. Really they just ignored health. It wasn’t an issue for them. So if they’re gonna have a look at that, well, good luck to them.
GILBERT:
How…sorry, Mitch?
FIFIELD:
I think it’s probably time that Labor themselves look at a bit of a front bench shake up. You’ve got Chris Bowen who’s the minister for dodgy websites…
ARBIB:
Doing an outstanding job.
FIFIELD:
…you’ve got Julia Gillard who can’t work out these days whether she’s actually trying to protect WorkChoices or abolish it and you’ve got a Treasurer and a Foreign Minister…
ARBIB:
Great minister.
FIFIELD:
… a Treasurer and a Foreign Minister who can’t be sent overseas to do their job. You’ve got a Prime Minister who feels the need to do the Treasurer’s job and the Foreign Minister’s job. So I think there’s a bit of a need for a change on the other side.
GILBERT:
We’ll get to that in a moment, the Prime Minister’s trip to New York. But first of all Mitch I want to ask you about Malcolm Turnbull. How much does he need to avoid any look that there is retribution being dished out as he tries to unify the Party? In terms of this new look front bench, how crucial is it to avoid any sense of people not being promoted for supporting the other guy?
FIFIELD:
There’s no question of anything of that sort. Malcolm has made clear that he’s going to promote a team on the basis of merit and that’s what this front bench will be. It will be our best team and Malcolm isn’t going to let any consideration get in the way of that. There’s absolutely no question of that.
ARBIB:
Well if it’s the best team then you should be there Mitch so that’ll be a big test. But the second one is…
FIFIELD:
Well…got to wait ’til 10 o’clock.
ARBIB:
…Tony Abbott has shown, Tony Abbott has shown the real character of the Liberal Party here. When you say that an area like Families, Seniors and Indigenous is not on the front line, I mean that just shows, really, what the Liberal Party is about. These issues aren’t important to them. And Tony Abbott has said it and let’s see today whether Malcolm Turnbull leaves him in that position or moves him to a more important issue.
GILBERT:
It’s good to see some camaraderie on the AM Agenda panel.
ARBIB:
We get on well.
FIFIELD:
Tony’s got a colourful turn of phrase but, you know, it’s important to have Tony there. He does have an important contribution to make.
ARBIB:
In Families?
FIFIELD:
I don’t think anyone has ever doubted Tony Abbott’s compassion or concern for families.
ARBIB:
He doesn’t want to be there though. He doesn’t want to be there. He doesn’t want to represent families.
GILBERT:
Okay well it must be good to have a bit of a boost from your colleague anyway. But let’s look at the Prime Minister’s trip to New York. He’s been vigorously defending this trip saying he’s meeting with economics regulators and so on, world leaders on this global economic crisis. But all these reasons Mark are basically, have come up after the trip was planned. Basically the primary reason was to address the UN General Assembly. Aren’t they just trying to politically inoculate themselves now?
ARBIB:
Well there’s something like a hundred heads of state over at the United Nations so it’s a great opportunity to be over there on big issues. But in terms of right now it’s fortuitous he is there. I mean last week the United States economy was on the brink. Absolutely on the bring of a systemic collapse.
GILBERT:
But it’s fortuitous politically too though isn’t it?
ARBIB:
Well its fortuitous for the country, for our national interest, to have the Prime Minister in a place where you’ve got a hundred world leaders. He can actually sit down and talk to the Treasury. He can actually sit down and talk to the World Bank about the emergency measures that are being put in place. I mean a lot of our future, a lot of the world’s economic future, depends on this rescue package that’s being put forward in terms of the buying out of debt. If that works, then really hopefully we’ll see stabilisation in terms of the world economy and our own economy and the US economy. If it doesn’t work, then we are in for a very very hard ride. And it’s important that the prime Minister is there to get first hand knowledge, whether it’s going to work and what it’s gonna be in the next couple of years.
GILBERT:
It’s a fair point, isn’t it, that our Prime Minister should be meeting world leaders. John Howard spent a lot of time overseas as Labor tells us. More than 60 days in 2005 alone.
FIFIELD:
We’re not saying that it’s not important for Prime Ministers to travel and for ministers to travel. Of course it’s necessary that they do. But you’ve got to get the balance right and particularly as a Prime Minister in your first year. You’re trying to bed your government down, you’re trying to implement your election commitments, you’re trying to honour your pledges to the Australian public. So it’s important that you get the balance right so you can actually be on the ground to do that. Kevin Rudd doesn’t seem to have much confidence in his Treasurer or his Foreign Minister. He feels the need to do their job for them overseas. Kevin Rudd has been overseas something of the order of 47 days. John Howard in his first year in office was overseas for 18 days. I think it’s important that Kevin Rudd spends a bit more time at base camp. He’s probably watched that old Charlton Heston movie 55 Days at Peking once too often. But you’ve got to get the balance right and I don’t think he’s doing that. And the reasons which he’s giving for this visit now, the troubles we’re having in the overseas financial markets, they’re post-facto reasons. The reason he’s going on this trip is to address the UN General Assembly on climate change. We’re not picking out any particular trip as not being appropriate, but we are saying he hasn’t got the balance right.
GILBERT:
Mark the, I suppose, he’s heading over there the second week that Turnbull’s in the job. I mean as a strategist, someone who watches politics so closely as you do, isn’t that just a free whack for a new Liberal leader to come in and say “look where are you?”
ARBIB:
But as a new Liberal leader he’s gonna have the spotlight anyway. Turnbull will be in the spotlight this week there’s no doubt about it. He’s announcing his new shadow ministry. The important thing is though, we’ve got our Prime Minister in the right place at the right time, talking to world leaders, talking to financial regulators about the important thing. About the economy and the effect it’s gonna have on working families. Can I just go back to something Mitch said. In terms of the opportunism that is being shown by the Liberal Party here. I mean we had yesterday Malcolm Turnbull saying on TV “oh he could’ve just made a phone call. Could’ve just rung up and had a chat.” Where months ago Malcolm Turnbull made an almost identical trip to the United States to see financial regulators. So it’s good enough for him to go there and he said at the time “you’ve got to have the first hand knowledge.” But now “oh you can just make a phone call.” So that is just total rubbish…
FIFIELD:
Malcolm is…
ARBIB:
…total rubbish from Malcolm Turnbull…
FIFIELD:
Malcolm’s not a Prime Minister in his first…
ARBIB:
…total rubbish from him…
FIFIELD:
Malcolm’s not a Prime Minister in his first term. He was a Shadow Treasurer. It’s an entirely different scenario.
ARBIB:
…Second. Last time when Kevin Rudd made an Asian trip it was Andrew Robb out there saying “oh he should’ve gone longer, he should’ve gone on to Japan. So I mean what we’re seeing is total opportunism. John Howard in 2005 did 65 days overseas. In 2003, 60 days…
FIFIELD:
That wasn’t his first year in office.
ARBIB:
It is just total opportunism by these guys.
FIFIELD:
You can spend that time overseas if you’re actually delivering on your commitments to the Australian people.
ARBIB:
We’re doing that Mitch. That’s why he’s over there.
GILBERT:
Okay gentleman we’ll continue next week. Thanks for your time
ARBIB:
Thank you.
FIFIELD:
Thank you.
ENDS