11 February, 2013
Sky News AM Agenda
With Kieran Gilbert and Andrew Leigh MP
11 February 2013
8:45am
E & OE
Subjects: Mining tax, drugs in sport, industrial relations
KIERAN GILBERT:
With me now Andrew Leigh, Labor MP and Liberal frontbencher Senator Mitch Fifield. Gentlemen it’s good to see you both. First of all Senator Fifield, let’s get your response to what Anthony Albanese said there about the mining tax. Revenues are down, that was the advice from the Tax Commissioner as well. And as I put to Christopher Pyne earlier in the morning, isn’t this the way that profit taxes are meant to operate? That you tax profits, substantial profits, when they’re there. When they’re not, you don’t.
MITCH FIFIELD:
The Government is saying that the reason that they’re not raising revenue, as well, is because commodity prices are down. Yet the fall in commodity prices was known before the MYEFO so that had taken that into account. Yet we had this absurd cat and mouse game for the past few weeks where Wayne Swan said to the Tax Office, “whatever you do, don’t tell me how much money this particular tax raised”. And that if he was told how much was raised, the Tax Office would be breaking the law. If he told the public how much was raised, he’d be breaking the law. We always said that was rubbish and it’s proved to be rubbish. But I’ve got to say, I feel for the poor old Treasury, who I think are being blamed for their forecasting. Let’s remember that the mining tax was not the design of the Treasury. It was personally designed by Wayne Swan and Julia Gillard with a few mining company executives. This is their design. You can’t blame the Treasury for the fact that this is raising no revenue. It’s on their head.
KIERAN GILBERT:
Crossbenchers Rob Oakeshott, the Greens, looking to close some of the loopholes today. Does it make sense to try and tweak it?
ANDREW LEIGH:
Kieran I think people need to recognise that profits-based taxes will have volatile revenues. So you can look back at the Petroleum Resource Rent Tax’s revenues. In 2008/09 it produces three times as much revenue as it produces two years later in 2010/11. These things go up and down driven partly by commodity prices, as Mitch correctly says, but also by firms investment decisions. And given that we’re in a phase of the mining boom where there is mammoth investment going in, I mean there’s projects there that are tens of billions of dollars, hundreds of billions of dollars in investment in aggregate. All that is deducted before you look at a firms profit. And so a high investment phase is going to be a lower profit phase.
KIERAN GILBERT:
Sure but what about the outgoings? They’re there on the books regardless aren’t they, the spend of $3 billion a year?
ANDREW LEIGH:
I think this is a bit cute. We have committed clearly in legislation to a set of important measures. Some of them are raising universal superannuation, so from nine to twelve per cent. Many of Mr Abbott’s backbenchers sit on fifteen per cent superannuation but it now seems that Mr Abbott is happy for superannuation to stay at nine per cent because he won’t support any revenue measure that’s been linked to the Minerals Resource Rent Tax.
MITCH FIFIELD:
No. We’ve said that we would not rescind the increase in the super guarantee. We’ve been very clear about that.
ANDREW LEIGH:
So you’ve changed your mind on that? So you’re supporting one bit of the Minerals Resource Rent Tax package but not other bits, such as for example taking tax on low income earners superannuation contributions down to zero.
KIERAN GILBERT:
You are saying that the guarantee, and I’ve heard this previously from your frontbench, that you will keep it.
MITCH FIFIELD:
That’s right. We will not rescind that. All other spending measures which were meant to be funded by the MRRT we can’t support those.
ANDREW LEIGH:
What’s special about this one, Mitch? I mean you voted against it in the Parliament and it doesn’t hit its peak until 2019, why do you now want to support this one?
MITCH FIFIELD:
We’re endeavouring to provide certainty for people with superannuation. That’s something which is a fundamental part of the people planning for their future. But the other elements of the MRRT spending package, this Government isn’t going to be able to afford. They’re not being upfront about it. We are.
KIERAN GILBERT:
Let’s move on. I want to talk about the drugs in sport issue. Christopher Pyne says that the Government’s botched it and that the timing, why did they release it at that time if not to distract the Government from its political woes. Senator Fifield, isn’t it the case that the independent crime commission will choose the timing of the release of such information?
MITCH FIFIELD:
The Australian Crime Commission is an independent body. I don’t know what led to the particular timing. But I think the Australian public are completely confused, baffled and bewildered by what we’re seeing. We’ve got the strange situation where we’re told that doping is endemic through professional sport in Australia yet we’re not really given any specific details. The only details that we have are those where the Essendon Football Club has essentially self-identified. I don’t think that there’s anyone in Australia who wouldn’t think that this whole situation couldn’t have been much better handled. There needed to be a clear process. When you come out and make an accusation about basically all professional sportspeople in Australia you’re tarring a lot of people. There must be a better way of doing it.
KIERAN GILBERT:
Andrew Leigh, it is far from clear process. The thing that baffles me a bit is that the clubs themselves, the Prime Minister is now saying it’s incumbent upon them to implicate themselves. In a legal situation, where else do you say to someone you put your hand up and say we’re guilty. It just seems to be a bit odd.
ANDREW LEIGH:
Kieran, clubs themselves are speaking with the authorities at the moment about some of the statements that have been made. Remember this is an investigation which has relied on undercover investigators, on phone taps. There is a great deal of information that is held by the Australian Crime Commission.
KIERAN GILBERT:
None of which can be used in a court.
ANDREW LEIGH:
Well some which will and some which won’t be able to be used in a court. But I think it’s important for politicians like Mitch and I and certainly Christopher Pyne to stay out of it. Christopher Pyne seems to be trying to get the George Brandis award for meddling in investigations. I think it would make much more sense if he stepped back and let authorities do his job on what is a very sensitive issue. Sports fans want to make sure that their sport is drug free. And that’s what this investigation is doing.
KIERAN GILBERT:
Alright and finally on to the issue of industrial relations. The Prime Minister we’ve only got a couple of minutes left so if you could make your point as quickly as we can but “family-friendly” is what the Prime Minister says but the Chamber of Commerce says it’s red tape.
ANDREW LEIGH:
If we can promote conversations between employers and employees to get the work-life balance right, I think that’s a great thing. I think we should be encouraging those conversations throughout workplaces because that makes us a more productive Australia. It allows us to use the skills and talents of every worker and allows them to be happy at work, not fretting about caring responsibilities, about kids and the likes.
KIERAN GILBERT:
Senator Fifield, what are your thoughts given what you’ve heard from that, the business chamber and others?
MITCH FIFIELD:
There is the capacity already for mothers to make a request for part-time work. That’s already there. So I think what we’ve seen at the weekend from the Prime Minister is possibly just some window-dressing. But we want to see the detail. The devil often is hiding there. But I think we’ve got to remember that ultimately workplace arrangements are something that are nutted out between an employer and an employee. You’ve want a situation where you find a solution that’s right for both the employer and the employee. Let’s not tie business up in hoops and red tape.
KIERAN GILBERT:
Senator Fifield and Mr Leigh, appreciate your time.