TRANSCRIPT
Of
SENATOR MITCH FIFIELD
Sky News AM Agenda
Ashleigh Gillon & Senator Mark Arbib
3 November 2008
8:45am
E & OE
SUBJECTS: Compulsory student unionism, Rudd phone call with President Bush, Bali bombers death penalty, interest rates
ASHLEIGH GILLON:
Let’s turn straight now to our panel. Joining me from Sydney is the Labor Senator Mark Arbib and from Melbourne the Liberal Senator Mitch Fifield. Senator Fifield firstly to you, this plan to impose compulsory fees on students, is this something the Opposition is looking at supporting?
SENATOR MITCH FIFIELD:
Well Ashleigh, here we go again. The Labor Party before the election put their hand on their heart and swore that they would never reintroduce compulsory student unionism. And it doesn’t matter what they call it, that’s what they’re doing. We’ve got to be clear here. If you listen to Kate Ellis you could be forgiven for thinking the previous government actually outlawed student unions and student associations. We didn’t. What we did was we stopped the compulsion of students to join associations and unions against their will.
GILLON:
But Senator Fifield, as Minister Ellis just said there, there is no movement here to make students join up to unions. This is about fees for services on campus.
FIFIELD:
Well the universities will give those funds to the unions and it’s a perverse sort of logic that we believe that students have the capacity and good judgement to choose their university, to choose their degree, to choose their courses but that their critical faculties leave them all of a sudden when it comes time to decide whether or not they value those services and whether or not they want to join those organisations. The onus should be on student unions and associations to convince students of the benefit of those services. If they can do a good job of that then they’ll have no problem attracting members. We really should view this, I think, as something analogous to membership of the NRMA or the RACV. We don’t give those organisations the capacity to compel funds. We don’t give some other body the capacity to collect money on their behalf and then give it to them. It’s up to those sorts of organisations to convince potential members of the benefits of those services.
GILLON:
Senator Arbib is this taking the road down the path of going back to compulsory student unionism?
SENATOR MARK ARBIB:
Definitely not and we’ve heard from the minister not two minutes ago actually state it’s not a return to compulsory student unionism. But what we’ve seen from Mitch Fifield today is exactly what the Liberal Party is about. They’re about ideology. This was one of the huge, big sort of emblems…
FIFIELD:
Freedom of association.
ARBIB:
…for the Liberal Party before the last election. Anytime they saw the word ‘union’ they went after it. If it was in the industrial field, it was WorkChoices and they went after the unions there and if it was on the university campuses they went after student unionism. This is not about unionism. This is about getting the services right on university campuses. In their ideological zest they have reduced the services that students are actually getting on campuses. And that means, I mean these are important services. We’re talking about childcare, we’re talking about sporting facilities, we’re talking about food, we’re talking about counselling, we’re talking about health services. These are the services that students aren’t getting now or are not getting a good standard. Universities are having to dip into their academic funds to actually make payments for this. So I mean I think this is a fair and balanced way to approach it. Putting forward a fee and also, as the Minister said, it’s not compulsory for the universities to undertake it.
GILLON:
Okay another story that exploded…
FIFIELD:
They will undertake it. But one final point on this…
GILLON:
Sorry Senator Fifield we’re just short on time I need to move on here. Sorry Senator. Another story that exploded after simmering for a week or so is the phone conversation between the US President George Bush and the Prime Minister Kevin Rudd. Mr Rudd’s office apparently leaked to The Australian newspaper that George Bush had asked the Prime Minister what the G20 is. This is being denied strenuously by the White House. Mark Arbib, how did this get leaked and it’s pretty embarrassing, isn’t it?
ARBIB:
Well I have no idea how this information came out. It was in the newspaper over a week ago and yesterday we saw Alexander Downer on about it. This was a private conversation between two leaders of two great countries. Both have denied that the reports in the paper are correct. So therefore, I mean that’s the end of the issue. Both those leaders have come out on it. There was a discussion about the G20 and the work that they’re doing in terms of the G20 and in terms of the work that they’re doing to buffer their economies from the global financial crisis. So, I mean the Liberal Party will come out again today. You saw Alexander Downer out yesterday. You’re gonna see their Shadow Foreign Affairs Minister out today and I’m sure Mitch Fifield will have plenty to say about it. But at the same time as that, it’s just a matter for the two leaders.
GILLON:
Senator Fifield, the Opposition’s now calling for a police inquiry into this matter. If this is such a major blunder why has it taken the Coalition more than a week to take any action on this?
FIFIELD:
Well you’re quite right, it is a major blunder on the part of the Government. It’s very important that heads of government can talk to each other in confidence. That they can talk about economic matters, security and defence issues in the certain knowledge that that discussion will go no further. That’s the basis upon which relationships between nation states are built. It’s trust. The Prime Minister has seriously damaged that trust, not just between Australia and the United States, but that trust between Australia and other countries. It’s important to bear this in mind, that every time a foreign head of state goes to meet an Australian Prime Minister they are given a brief on the Prime Minister, on the person that they’re going to meet. And that brief goes through issues such as the trustworthiness of the person that they’re meeting. Our Prime Minister gets those briefs when he meets foreign heads of state. And you can guarantee that whenever a foreign head of state gets that brief from their relevant agency that brief will say ‘be very very careful about talking to Kevin Rudd because you can’t trust him.’ And that’s of great damage to our reputation internationally and particularly to our bilateral relationship with the US.
GILLON:
Senator Arbib, the Prime Minister’s office has been criticised for being too young, perhaps too inexperienced, this is something we’ve heard about for some months now. Is this perhaps an example of that?
ARBIB:
That’s just crazy. I mean you’ve got a government that is doing a fantastic job at the moment in terms of dealing with the global financial crisis, getting out there with decisive action. I mean no one is making criticisms of the Government or their staff in terms of that. I mean in all issues…
FIFIELD:
Tell that to the people with frozen funds…
ARBIB:
…we take a sensible and balanced approach. In terms of this issue and I mean we’re hearing the theatrics of the Liberal Party on this. Mitch wasn’t, Mitch Fifield wasn’t out there when John Howard made over the top comments about Barack Obama in terms of Al Qaeda would be celebrating his election. And Peter Dutton, also a Shadow Minister, made recent comments about Obama as well. As recent as September this year…
FIFIELD:
He was talking about a matter of policy principle.
ARBIB:
…As recent as September this year saying that Obama had no substance. So in terms of, I think they’re going over the top here in terms of their position. There are very important issues, there are very very important issues at the moment…
FIFIELD:
It’s quite different to briefing off and leaking a confidential discussion with the President of the United States. I mean you can’t laugh this off Mark. This is serious business. This affects our relationships with other nations. America, the great fear is, will not be as candid with the Australian Prime Minister as previously because they will have the fear that you don’t know if what you say to the Australian Prime Minister will be kept in confidence. That is very damaging to our national interest.
ARBIB:
Well both leaders have denied it and in terms of, I mean, the Opposition yesterday were saying ‘oh this is a huge issue in the United States at the moment.’ Can I tell you, I think that in the United States at the moment the President George Bush, the White House staff and everybody else is focussed on the election campaign. I don’t think they’re going to be thinking about Australia at the moment Mitch.
FIFIELD:
It’s important in the bureaucracy, it’s important in the diplomatic community and it’s important in the minds of American officials and officials of other countries who will be meeting with the Australian Prime Minister. In fact the agencies who advise those heads of state…
ARBIB:
You should tell Peter Dutton that.
FIFIELD:
…would be irresponsible if they didn’t tell their leaders that you can’t trust this Australian Prime Minister.
GILLON:
Senators, we’ll hear a lot more about this today, but another big issue on of course today which everyone is talking about is the execution of the Bali bombers. It could happen today or perhaps in the next 24 hours. Mark Arbib we know the party line is not to intervene and speak out against the death penalty for these bombers. But is it hypocritical to do so when Australians are involved and not when members of other, citizens of other countries are involved?
ARBIB:
Not at all. Our position in terms of the death penalty is clear. We oppose it. But in terms of speaking out for foreign terrorists, well it’s just not something you’re going to see the Labor Party or the Federal Government doing. These men have been convicted in their own country of murders, 88 Australians lost their lives and I think something like 202 people in total lost their lives and I don’t think I’ll be shedding a tear over it.
GILLON:
Senator Fifield is this not a universal value?
FIFIELD:
Look it is a universal value and it’s something that is bipartisan in Australia. When we were in government, when Labor are in government, we oppose the death penalty both domestically and beyond our shores. The Australian Government does have an obligation to intercede, to make representations on behalf of Australian citizens who find themselves faced with capital punishment. But there’s absolutely no obligation on an Australian government to argue on behalf of foreign citizens who find themselves in that situation. Particularly when those foreign citizens were murderers, those foreign citizens murdered 88 Australians. There’s no obligation on the Australian Government in this circumstance and I think most Australians would actually be rightly outraged if the Australian Government did seek to intercede on behalf of those people.
GILLON:
Okay let’s just look forward to tomorrow. All eyes will be on the Reserve Bank when they meet to decide whether or not to cut interest rates. It’s likely the official cash rate will be cut again, perhaps by half a percent this time. Mark Arbib, is that a cut that the banks should be passing on in full?
ARBIB:
They should pass on as much as they possibly can and certainly if they’re not going to pass on the full amount well they should be out there explaining why not because they need to talk about what’s happening with their borrowing costs and they’ve also got to explain now that they’ve got the guarantee why they shouldn’t pass on the full amount of interest rates. But at the same time as that the Government has been right on top of this issue and in terms of the previous rate cut the Government’s position was correct and we gave the banks some slack and they passed on the full amount outside the Reserve Bank’s decision. So in terms of interest rates obviously everyone’s hopeful tomorrow of a cut. Markets are factoring it in and obviously we’ve seen cuts at the global level, a global co-operation in terms of rate cuts. So let’s hope tomorrow there’s another cut.
GILLON:
Senator Fifield we can assume the Opposition Leader will again be pushing on for this to be passed on in full?
FIFIELD:
Absolutely. Malcolm Turnbull, unlike Mark Arbib, unlike Chris Bowen yesterday, unlike Wayne Swan, won’t be using weasel words. He won’t be saying ‘pass on as much as you think you can.’ Which is basically saying ‘banks, whatever you want that’s fine with us.’ We think the whole amount should be passed on. For the life of me I can’t understand why the Government can’t utter those same words, that they think it should be passed on. We think it should. And there’s also something else to look out for tomorrow. If the Reserve Bank doesn’t cut rates by the magnitude which most people were expecting, then I think that’s a sign that the Government’s stimulus package hasn’t left enough room for monetary policy to do its job. So that’s also something to look out for. But why the Government can’t say ‘the banks should pass on the full amount,’ I don’t know.
GILLON:
Alright we have run out of time. Senators Mitch Fifield and Mark Arbib thank you both for joining us again.
ENDS