30 May, 2011
Sky News – AM Agenda
Kieran Gilbert and the Hon Richard Marles MP
30 May 2011
8:40am
E & OE
Subjects: Carbon tax, Liberal Party
KIERAN GILBERT:
Welcome to AM Agenda. Joining me this morning is Parliamentary Secretary for Parliamentary Secretary for Pacific Island Affairs, Richard Marles, and Manager of Opposition Business in the Senate, Senator Mitch Fifield. Gentlemen, great to see you both. I want to ask you, Senator Fifield, first of all about the Cate Blanchett advertisement, which has been criticised by Barnaby Joyce and other Coalition colleagues. Why shouldn’t she have a say? Why can’t she front this advertisement?
MITCH FIFIELD:
She’s got every right to front this advertisement. But one of the surprising things for me is, not only did Julia Gillard abrogate responsibility to the Australian people by lying about not introducing a carbon tax, she’s abrogated responsibility to actually explain what she’s doing. She’s got everyone out there trying to explain this tax, other than her own ministers. You’ve got Ross Garnaut who’s out there doing public meetings, you’ve got the Climate Change Commission undertaking public meetings, and now you’ve got actors out there. And I know from the republic campaign that often it’s the kiss of death for a campaign when the actors are deployed. Julia Gillard should be out there, but I think the person who’s most of all missing in action is Wayne Swan. He’s the Treasurer this is supposedly a major economic reform, this is a big new tax – and the Treasurer is completely missing in action.
GILBERT:
You’re talking about the actors and I did ask you about the actors, so I won’t be critical of that. But what about the others who have signed on? A couple of Liberal figures were there Malcolm Fraser and John Hewson.
FIFIELD:
I’m less concerned what former Prime Ministers think about the carbon tax than I am about the behaviour of the current Prime Minister, who told a bald-faced lie to the Australian people. She said “there will be no carbon tax under a Government I lead.” There is going to be a carbon tax if she has her way.
GILBERT:
Is the Government abrogating responsibility, Richard Marles, and off-loading it to the likes of Michael Caton and Rebecca Gibney?
MARLES:
Well, Mitch has been gracious about Cate Blanchett’s right to have her say. And of course, all the people you mention have the right to voice their opinion. And I actually didn’t see any of the Liberals out there as Barnaby Joyce was in relation to Cate Blanchett when Gina Rinehart and Twiggy Forrest were campaigning to keep the profits of the mining companies. I think what we’ve seen from Barnaby Joyce is really the glass jaw of conservative politics here. Look, the Government’s been out there Greg Combet is in the paper today, Wayne Swan is in the paper today in relation to the climate change debate. And of course, Julia Gillard has been on the front foot as well, making sure that all the Ministers are out there on this issue, as they should be, because this is one of the great issues facing our country.
GILBERT:
How important is the next week, Richard Marles, with the Garnaut Report out tomorrow – apparently it’s going to look at complementary measures like renewable energy funds, which sounds like it’s going to be a key point to get the Greens over the line. There’s also going to be the Productivity Commission Report, which is going to analyse what the rest of the world is doing. If this comes in light-on, and shows that China isn’t doing as much as we’ve been told and other countries are not doing as much, you might not get Tony Windsor on board for this. He said this morning that we’ll be lemmings off a cliff if other countries aren’t acting in this area.
MARLES:
Well other countries are acting on climate change, and we’re going to see that in the coming days with the reports that you mentioned coming out. And these are very important pieces in the jigsaw puzzle. And I think you’re really seeing the momentum going forward on what is a really crucial debate for this country. The voice which is missing here is the voice of the Opposition. All we hear is this constant negativity…
GILBERT:
So you’re confident that the Productivity Commission will show that there’s enough happening to ensure Tony Windsor is on board? Because he said this morning on the doors of Parliament, “if the world is serious on carbon tax, I’m serious. If the world is not moving, we’re lemmings off a cliff.”
MARLES:
Well that comment gives me confidence about where Tony Windsor will end up, because the world is serious in relation to action on climate change. And we must make sure that we are not left behind. That’s the real issue here. If we are left behind and our economy gets left behind, then that is going to be the ultimate job-destroyer for Australian industry and the Australian people. That’s why we need to move on this now.
GILBERT:
This is a very important report, this Productivity Commission Report, in conjunction with Professor Garnaut’s Report. It’s going to set the context globally on what’s happening. Now, if it does show that the rest of the world is acting, haven’t you got a bit of a fight on your hands to show why we should not be mobilising on this?
FIFIELD:
Well I can tell you now, the rest of the world is not introducing a carbon tax. The rest of the world is not, in isolation, penalising their own industries; that’s what this Government wants to do. And business understand that clearly. We’ve had the AI Group come out and say that they think there should only be a $10 per tonne price on carbon. That’s effectively them saying there shouldn’t be a carbon tax. ACCI have said there should be no carbon tax and other business organisations are saying that there should be an extremely low carbon tax.
GILBERT:
What about these 15 energy companies…
MARLES:
But why are they saying anything at all? If this is all rubbish, and if the rest of the world isn’t moving, why are they saying anything at all? The fact of the matter is that their action here is a really significant change in this debate, which shows that there really is public support for this, we need to show action. And it isolates the Liberal Party on the extreme edge of the debate half-full of climate deniers coming up with a half-baked idea which is going to cost the Australian public millions of dollars and do nothing but add extra tonnes of carbon dioxide into the atmosphere.
GILBERT:
Let’s get Senator Fifield’s response, but also in detail on the energy companies who’ve come out and backed this today.
FIFIELD:
A lot of businesses and business organisations know that they’ve got to pay lip service to a carbon tax, because the Labor Party is very good at punishing organisations and businesses that don’t say the right things publicly. So when you hear a business lobby say, ‘look, we think there should be a carbon tax but it should only be $10 per tonne,’ you’ve got to get real. That’s them effectively saying, ‘no, we don’t think that there should be a tax, but we’re going to pay lip service because we don’t want to be targeted or abused by the Government.’
GILBERT:
Richard, what do you say to that?
MARLES:
Well that idea that companies feel a need to counter the Government, that’s not what I saw with the mining companies last year. They weren’t particularly shy about issuing their opinion about what should happen with our tax system. The fact of the matter is that AIG and BCA have come out saying that there should be action. The reason they’ve come out saying that is because they think there should be action. Because they’re…
GILBERT:
But $10 per tonne is not much to write home about.
MARLES:
Well the point is that they’re saying we need to start to move and they’re saying that for a reason; because they see the rest of the world moving and they don’t want us to be left behind.
GILBERT:
One of the distractions for you on the Liberal side of politics in the last week or so has been some internal divisions coming to the surface. It’s unusual given you’re so far in front in the polls that this sort of stuff would emerge. Why did it?
FIFIELD:
Well I think if you look at the period since Tony Abbott became leader, this has probably been the most united Opposition that there’s been in recent Australian political history. There will in any Opposition be the odd bit of untidiness, and that’s really all that we’ve seen. This is an incredibly united team. Our senior leadership group is rock-solid, and everyone is behind Tony Abbott because he’s doing a great job prosecuting the case that this Government want to increase cost-of-living pressures.
GILBERT:
Joe Hockey said yesterday, Senator Fifield, that people need to put the ambition of the nation ahead of their own personal ambition. Who is he directing that comment to?
FIFIELD:
I think he’s just reminding colleagues that ultimately, in politics, it’s not about you. It’s about the constituents that you serve. I think that’s a good reminder for all politicians. We’ve got to focus on the people’s business, we’ve got to focus on the job of being a credible alternative government, and that’s what we’re doing.
GILBERT:
That was something that Tony Abbott said last week, that your lead could be fleeting; ephemeral. Now tell me, what do you think of that email that was sent by the Chief Opposition Whip? Was that appropriate to name and shame five of your colleagues in front of your colleagues, including Malcolm Turnbull, saying they showed great disrespect to the Party?
FIFIELD:
Absolutely. The Whip’s business is discipline. They’re a little bit like the military police; they cut across the hierarchy – they supecede that their job is to make sure that people are doing what they’re meant to do. Let’s face it we’re voted in, and we’re paid to turn up and to vote. And that’s what all colleagues should do.
GILBERT:
And the bottom line, Richard, is that these sorts of things happen on your side of politics too. The Coalition, despite these couple of hiccups, are still well in front in the opinion polls.
MARLES:
Well there’s been a lot of newsprint in the last couple of days for just a little bit of untidiness or a hiccup, as you put it Kieran. The fact of the matter is that Tony Abbott doesn’t stand for anything. His constant negativity has masked over the fact that he doesn’t offer a single solution to any problem being faced by this country today, and a whole lot of Liberals are calling him on it. We don’t know what he stands for on plain packaging for tobacco, we don’t know what he stands for in relation to a carbon price. Malcolm Fraser is absolutely right on this one we don’t know what he stands for because he’s already changed his mind. Who knows where he’ll end up on anything. This is a guy who said you can’t believe him unless he puts it in writing, he said that he supports pragmatism over policy…
GILBERT:
But he’s well in front in the opinion polls, so obviously the public like what they see.
MARLES:
Well, if you want to talk about opinion polls, we’re going through, we’re doing difficult things, we’re facing what is a real problem for this country in terms of our dependency upon carbon, and we’re trying to do something about it. That’s a hard thing to do easy to wreck, hard to do.
GILBERT:
Richard Marles and Senator Fifield, great to see you, thanks for that.
FIFIELD:
Thanks Kieran.
GILBERT:
That’s all for AM Agenda this morning.
ENDS